Some color profiles not being handled correctly...

Adam Albrec's Avatar

Adam Albrec

24 Feb, 2018 03:39 AM

As per chatting with C.K. on the Dev Blog, here is an image that for some reason renders in TenFourFox incorrectly because of profile mishandling. Have been running into these every now and again, and am not sure what would be needed to fix compatibility with this. Strangely, it works OK in Preview and Safari.

If it can't be fixed, isn't the end of the world, but curious if their is a solution.
Adam :0)

  1. Support Staff 1 Posted by Chris (chtrusch... on 24 Feb, 2018 07:41 AM

    Chris (chtrusch)'s Avatar

    This looks identical on my systems (10.4 and 10.5) in TFF FPR5 (fresh user profile, all defaults), Safari and Preview. Embedded profile reads "DC Colour labs Frontier Lustre" in Photoshop.

  2. 2 Posted by Adam Albrec on 24 Feb, 2018 05:10 PM

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    You are seeing normal color?? It looks fine in Safari, but I can see it normally in TFF. Run into one of these every few hours.
    How do you have your color-management set in TFF?

  3. Support Staff 3 Posted by Cameron Kaiser on 24 Feb, 2018 05:43 PM

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    I'll check this on my own system when I'm back from this business trip (I only have the MacBook Air with me right now), but if Chris sees it normally with a clean profile, then it's the default setting.

  4. Support Staff 4 Posted by Chris (chtrusch... on 24 Feb, 2018 06:11 PM

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    I wouldn't call the colors in this picture 'normal' to begin with, but yes, in TFF they look exactly the same as in Safari. Defaults are gfx.color_management.mode = 1 and gfx.color_management.enablev4 = true

  5. Support Staff 5 Posted by Chris (chtrusch... on 24 Feb, 2018 06:30 PM

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    Adam, can you post a screenshot showing what the picture looks like in your TenFourFox?

  6. 6 Posted by Adam Albrec on 24 Feb, 2018 06:48 PM

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    I found another one. As soon as I disable All color managment, it renders fine. How does TenFourFox handle this internally? I'd like to just shut it off, but I do commercial photography and design and need it to look right onscreen and the gamma-correction, if nothing else is brutal on these older Macs.

  7. Support Staff 7 Posted by Chris (chtrusch... on 24 Feb, 2018 06:57 PM

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    Do you have a display profile specified in gfx.color_management.display_profile?

  8. 8 Posted by Adam Albrec on 24 Feb, 2018 07:54 PM

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    Hey Chris: Sorry for the delay just wanted to do some testing and it does appear to be working for MOST images, just not that profile (or ones like it). I have my monitors set to Gamma 2.2 for web-work at my TFF settings as thus:

    user_pref("gfx.color_management.display_profile", "/Library/ColorSync/Profiles/Displays/A.S.D. #1 Gamma 2.2 (08/30/17)-42482C0.icc");
    user_pref("gfx.color_management.rendering_intent", 0);

    Now most sites work properly - and render just right (with Flickr, the moment I disable CM and restart, everything appears too dark as expected), but every now and again, I'll run into these images with strange profiles that it just can't handle.

    Isn't a huge problem, but worth checking on if you all get time. BTW - did a check of version 4 profiles and they still check-out fine with CM enabled
    http://www.color.org/version4html.xalter So this must be some new thing. Effects roughly 1 out of every 50 or so images I see on Flickr or Instagram.

  9. 9 Posted by Adam Albrec on 24 Feb, 2018 07:57 PM

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    Cameron - on another note, this is worth powering up your Intel Mac to see. WebGL at its best. Impossible for TFF, but you might get this on your Talos at some point.

    http://rainbowhunt.com/

  10. Support Staff 10 Posted by Chris (chtrusch... on 24 Feb, 2018 08:12 PM

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    Adam, please try this: Reset gfx.color_management.display_profile (right-click the entry in about:config, the choose Reset). Restart the browser and check if your example above still has a problem.

  11. 11 Posted by Adam Albrec on 24 Feb, 2018 10:02 PM

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    No Change.

  12. 12 Posted by Adam Albrec on 24 Feb, 2018 10:04 PM

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    The only change that makes the image-in-question look normal is to completely disable color-managment (which means a person has to be in gamma 1.8) for things to look remotely correct: For me this won't work, but for most people this is probably an acceptable situation, if a fix for that newer profile isn't possible.

  13. Support Staff 13 Posted by Chris (chtrusch... on 24 Feb, 2018 10:25 PM

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    We are going to need more data points from people who can reproduce the problem. I can't.

  14. 14 Posted by Adam Albrec on 24 Feb, 2018 11:06 PM

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    I think the reason I'm having troubles is that I've selected the destination (monitor) profile, that then asks it to not only convert the incoming-profile to internal working-space, but also to a final output-space, and the default setting only takes that first step (thereby only enabling Version 4 ICC profiles), and staying there.

    Like I said earlier, for anyone at native Gamma 1.8 this is totally fine as the only thing they really need is version 4 support, but people who need to take that next step as Safari does automatically via ColorSync (or Intel Firefox does on modern platforms), can't quite get there with the current implementation. This might be a break since the fork from WebGL which TenFourFox can't support. I've really only noticed this issue since around then.

    Thanks for Trying, isn't the end of the world, by any means, just something to toss out there.

    --------------------------------------------
    On Sat, 2/24/18, Chris (chtrusch) <[email blocked]> wrote:

     Subject: Re: Some color profiles not being handled correctly... [Problems #8562]
     To: [email blocked]
     Date: Saturday, February 24, 2018, 2:25 PM
     
     
     
       
         
         
     #yiv1658884814 pre {
     width:92%;margin:10px 2%;padding:5px
     2%;background:#efefef;border:1px solid #d6d6d6;}
     #yiv1658884814 blockquote {
     margin-left:0;padding-left:1em;border-left:5px solid #ccc;}
     
       
       
         
           
             
               // Please reply above this
     line

  15. Support Staff 15 Posted by Cameron Kaiser on 28 Feb, 2018 05:22 AM

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    Adam, I can't reproduce this either (10.4, gfx.color_management.enablev4;true, gfx.color_management.mode;1, gfx.color_management.rendering_intent;0, using a Huey calibrated profile for ColorSync).

  16. 16 Posted by Adam Albrec on 28 Feb, 2018 06:10 AM

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    No worries - thanks for checking. Like I said earlier, I think the breakage comes from assigning a destination (display profile) as per Mozilla instructions =>
    user_pref("gfx.color_management.display_profile", "/Library/ColorSync/Profiles/Displays/A.S.D. #1 Gamma 2.2 (08/30/17)-42482C0.icc");

    If I remove the destination profile I don't have any problems either, but the usefulness of this seems to break when having to convert beyond the initial jump to Mac's internal working-space (gamma 1.8). I've set this in countless Linux setups and even a Win10 install without problems.

    I can totally live with it (can always grab an effected pic and open in preview), and most images make the full trip to my display profile just fine. It's only these rare ones that seem to have trouble.

    Sadly today for graphics and web-work gamma 1.8 is just really inconvenient.

    No biggy - just something to file away if another related symptom pops up later.

    --------------------------------------------
    On Tue, 2/27/18, Cameron Kaiser <[email blocked]> wrote:

     Subject: Re: Some color profiles not being handled correctly... [Problems #8562]
     To: [email blocked]
     Date: Tuesday, February 27, 2018, 9:22 PM
     
     
     
       
         
         
     #yiv8532486865 pre {
     width:92%;margin:10px 2%;padding:5px
     2%;background:#efefef;border:1px solid #d6d6d6;}
     #yiv8532486865 blockquote {
     margin-left:0;padding-left:1em;border-left:5px solid #ccc;}
     
       
       
         
           
             
               // Please reply above this
     line

  17. Support Staff 17 Posted by Cameron Kaiser on 28 Feb, 2018 02:17 PM

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    There is specific code in the debug builds to list how custom profiles load. Note that I also have a custom colour profile, but mine is system-wide (i.e., in System Preferences, Displays, not specifically in TenFourFox). If you want, run a debug build and look at the output, and see if errors appear that reference your ColorSync profile. It's possible there's a corner case in it or maybe there's a bug in how we handle them, though I'm unclear from your replies if removing it from TenFourFox actually helped. You may need to restart the browser to reset the profile in use.

    Are you using this same profile in System Preferences? How are you specifying it for Safari?

  18. 18 Posted by Adam Albrec on 28 Feb, 2018 04:52 PM

    Adam Albrec's Avatar

    Thanks Again - that is a thought. Mine are saved system-wide in /Library/Colorsync rather than ~/Library, but I do have two monitors and with ADC, the system will only allow a customization to apply to the particular monitor it was made for (they have a sort-of byhost type ID that blocks the other monitor from seeing them), but I have TFF set to the primary. I wonder if this really fully-works without selecting that destination profile? The moment I remove it from prefs, the problem goes away BUT then everything is being treated as Gamma 1.8. Since I'm normally at 2.2 you can really see the jump (like in the old days when Mac and PC people each had to use Image Ready to gamma-correct web content or share assets.

    • Are these debug builds downloadable from the same place? Happy to try this.

    I kinda wonder if you guys are actually having your profiling work?? Version 4 Profiles are being seen (like in this test http://www.color.org/version4html.xalter ).

    It's like in Printing (I ran a print house for years and still consult on it today), you have your source-space (1), working-space (2) and print or destination-space (3). It seems like for these specific profiles it makes it from 1 to 2, but never quite gets to 3.
    Most likely, OSX has a background working-space that is transparent to the user and with the settings you have, you are getting to that place with everything. You might not see a minor variation if your profile actually isn't being used (especially if running at 1.8 with everything else).

    --------------------------------------------
    On Wed, 2/28/18, Cameron Kaiser <[email blocked]> wrote:

     Subject: Re: Some color profiles not being handled correctly... [Problems #8562]
     To: [email blocked]
     Date: Wednesday, February 28, 2018, 6:17 AM
     
     
     
       
         
         
     #yiv8286900295 pre {
     width:92%;margin:10px 2%;padding:5px
     2%;background:#efefef;border:1px solid #d6d6d6;}
     #yiv8286900295 blockquote {
     margin-left:0;padding-left:1em;border-left:5px solid #ccc;}
     
       
       
         
           
             
               // Please reply above this
     line

  19. 19 Posted by Adam Albrec on 28 Feb, 2018 05:31 PM

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    OK as a follow-up. you can see in my color profiling that each monitor has it's own set of profiles (marked #1 and #2). In the event that those have gone bad, selected the default "Apple Studio Display" profile for both.

    1. Sadly, even then it still does the same thing on the occasional image in this Twitter feed.

    2. But the moment I remove that destination profile from the mix, the problem goes away.

    But without a full-on destination profile, you are not really getting your money's worth - just the assimilation of Version 4 spaces.

    Am happy to try the debug version if you can point me toward it, but seriously don't want you to spend a lot more time on this - since it isn't going to affect most users - just a thing to keep in the periphery.

    --------------------------------------------
    On Wed, 2/28/18, Cameron Kaiser <[email blocked]> wrote:

     Subject: Re: Some color profiles not being handled correctly... [Problems #8562]
     To: [email blocked]
     Date: Wednesday, February 28, 2018, 6:17 AM
     
     
     
       
         
         
     #yiv3496222804 pre {
     width:92%;margin:10px 2%;padding:5px
     2%;background:#efefef;border:1px solid #d6d6d6;}
     #yiv3496222804 blockquote {
     margin-left:0;padding-left:1em;border-left:5px solid #ccc;}
     
       
       
         
           
             
               // Please reply above this
     line

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